Know-How Exchange : Branding

Thank you wnelson, this is a good start on this issue.
I'm actually thinking to come in as a consultant. However, I think their thoughts are to bring me in as a committee member - to head Marketing efforts for them. Can you be compensated as a committee member?

There is no shame in getting paid for your efforts. Like Wayde said, ask to wshom you would present your bill.

Now, if it's pro bono, and you are okay with donating your skills and efforts, ask for a tax receipt for donation in kind.

If you have already committed to complete the project, and they expect it for no charge, well, do the work and eat the bill.

Are you in position to ask for payment, or will you be donating your time and efforts? Its all up to you.

Darcy

Well, I haven't finalized how I would proceed, however, I have agreed to help. My intent will be to proceed in a manner that will work for both the org. and myself. It's good to know that one does not have to feel as though you can't expect to be compensated despite they're a non profit org. Thank you for your input.

wow, these were all accepted quickly. no sense in adding anything else.

Colette,

Without specifics on the organization, it's hard to give you a definite answer. In most cases for non-profits - like the Boy Scouts of America, Parent Teacher Organizations, and the YMCA/YWCA - committee members are volunteers.

It seems to me that perhaps the person with whom you are working is thinking of getting some "free" effort completed. If you don't have the time, desire, and/or can't afford to do this pro bono, then you need to make your position clear. One of two things can happen as a result: The person will put together a committee to do the work without you, or he/she will tell you to put together a proposal and it will go through the board of directors for approval.

In the former possibility, OK - they will have someone else do it for free. You're off the hook.

I have to warn you - this second possibility is actually a BAD deal for you, most likely. You will spend tons of time putting together a proposal and with many non-profits, it will go no where. First, most people undervalue marketing and think that anyone can do it - so why pay someone. Additionally, non-profits don't think about marketing at all - many board members only think about the cause they represent and their own feel-good efforts. Quite often, they want all monies to go to "the cause" versus getting their message out to gain support and help from the community. The people who do the work every day see the tremendous value of marketing and how it will help them accomplish their task. They will be enthusiastic and positive. They will ask for a proposal that they will offer to present it to their board member who will present it to the board. But since this likely will not be on their list of issues, no decision is every made.

So before you put a bunch of work into a proposal, ask your contact this: Let's pretend I put together a proposal for you. What happens? What would make the proposal get accepted and who makes that decision? What is their criteria for making this decision? How long will it take? Will they request proposals from other consultants? Is the decision as to who gets the work going to based solely on price?

Then, ask if you can talk to the person or group before you put together a proposal so you can understand what their requirements are - to take them into account in your proposal. You want to be in front of the decision makers versus be represented by your contact. They can't sell your proposal as effectively as you. And if you are going to put a bunch of time into a proposal, you want a good chance it will be accepted. Otherwise, it's a waste of your time.

On the other hand, if you can see some benefit to you to do this job - PR for you and your firm, contacts in the community who can lead to paying gigs later, free advertising in their newsletter or website, etc - then "volunteer" as Committee Head and ask for authority to choose committee members, make the decisions, and assign work. Make it clear that if you don't get the right committee members, you will have to delay the work until you have a committee. As committee head, you can control how much time you put into it this. You can recruit "help" with the right skills - use your status as "volunteer" to get others to help. And you can still seek a receipt for your services to use for tax purposes.

Wayde

Wayde,
I am sorry to say it, but you have hit the nail on the head... many not-for-profit boards dont appreciate marketing. And, unfortunately, many people in business dont appreciate marketing either. They just wonder why the other guy is doing better than them.

Colette,
Here would be my strategy for you...
As you develop materials, develop a good-better-best approach. This was my favorite part of dealing with Sears back in the early 70's. they had a good-better-best for every appliance known to man. For instance, their good washing machine would get your clothes clean but did not include a delicate cycle or rinse and hold. The better included many fine features and of course the best had everything. The deal was presented, you can get a new washer for $100 but if these other features have value they are 50 and 75 more.
So how does this apply to you.. I would present plans in a good better best way. The good would be you doing your nice guy volunteer job, the better and best of course would require a bit of money...

This gives you a way to test out their intentions without making enemies.

And allows me to relive my freshly graduated from school days shopping at the local Sears..

Frank

Wayde, you are so right. I think it's an effort to get a proposal written up - without much regard of how much work this really can take. That said, I do agree with you that I need to decide on the best way to approach this and whether I really have the time to do it all or if whether I want to pick a team.
Thanks for the info!

Frank, I can so appreciate the Good, Better, Best approach. I remember that during my retail days!
For sure I've thought of that approach in the whole scope of things. The reality for most orgs./bus's on a whole they don't appreciate the efforts of Marketing and wonder why their true competitors are doing far better than they are. Incidentally, I have a client who is going through that right now. I'd like to post this out to get a general consensus on what one can do when they think they can't afford to do much marketing or don't see why it's necessary - despite sharing what their options are...
Thanks!

I won't add much to the thread because it's been well discussed (although I do always say, "If you don't put a value on your time, who will?").

However, I think it's important to clarify that, at least in the US, you can NOT deduct the value of your time as a donation. The IRS is very clear about this (see IRS Publication 526 - https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p526.pdf).

If you are using an accrual method of accounting, you could possibly invoice (book the income) for the work and then write the invoice off (book the expense), but that would be a wash. It will not reduce your taxable income.

What drew you to the org in the first place-- or did they find you?

If you are coming in as a committee member, they are expecting you to donate your time. If you feel this is above and beyond volunteer work-- I'd propose to do certain types of work as part of being a volunteer. But beyond, you'll ask for compensation -- and define it up front --make it all clear and professional.

A nonprofit does not mean they are without money. The IRS is very clear (I founded a nonprofit) they expect a nonprofit to be profitable.

Another way to do this is take your time as a in kind donation. If you feel the value of your time is worth x a month, and you donate it to the org-- they treat your donation at an appropriate level of sponsorship and you receive the recognition accordingly. How does your org recognize high level donors? This is how we recognize ours on our website-- would having your name on theirs benefit your business? What value would it have?https://www.usgbccolorado.com/

As an inkind donation, it very well can be tax deductible but make sure it is well documented, and a good paper trail. You are not just saying my time is worth x (as in the IRS doc referenced above) and I want to deduct that time. However, depending on your business structure it may be better than taking it as a donation to a nonprofit but as marketing expense. Again, you must have it well documented.

Most companies donate for the exposure, the benefit to their company. In my nonprofit we brought in a pro as yourself and gave him a seat on the board. He did not get (or ask) for compensation, but his high level of exposure got him additional jobs that more than compensated for his time.

Sell Well and Prosper tm

The org. actually asked me to help them with some of their marketing concerns in particular a "marketing strategy plan".

Carol are you suggesting I not go in as a committee member? Should I just "consult" my services as a consultant and whether I obtain compensation or submit invoices as a "marketing expense" it would be better?

If you are a committee member, you'll be doing a lot of work outside the marketing plan. Its up to you how you feel connected to the org. They may not be able/willing to pay and want all your work as a volunteer-- do you have an idea how healthy financially the org is? You could do 3 months pro bono, with the agreement to charge after. There are lots of options for you. Or "forgive" a percent of your monthly invoices. They could do something back for you-- highlighting your marketing efforts in a way that you could not purchase by yourself. That is how our marketing specialist considered his work-- he did not charge. He was new to the area and wanted to build a niche marketing non profits. We rarely paid for outside services-- but gave our donors an abundance of exposure.

I never charged for anything I did-- I have always been involved in a nonprofit and feel strongly about the need to "give back". I have served on some nonprofit most my adult life. I will also tell you working with a nonprofit is very hard work. You have to please everyone on the board-- and while you'd think they are there for a common cause-- and they are-- they are each in it for their own reason. Is a thankless, never ending job- but I have no regrets and its served me well.

The IRS has no reservations about committee people charging for their product or service. Many people get invovled with these orgs to network-- the IRS recognizes that. As long as its "fair market value". For example, if you have office space and you donate use of space to a nonprofit-- and serves on the board or is somehow connected to the org-- that is allowable as long as they pay fair market value-- and no more. When we would use/pay a committee member, we'd get another bid -- that way we are proving "fair market value" Your nonprofit must list in their tax return any donation exceeding-- and I'm going from memory, $50K a year. That would be a flag to them. Make sure you can validate it.

Its called an "in kind" donation and its done all the time. The IRS would have issue, if in the previous example posted-- you were not in the related business and are just declaring a personal deduction for your time. Or, if you normally charge clients $100/hour and seeing this as a windfall-- inflate your invoices to $200/hour.

Depending on how your business is structured both donations could be equal tax wise to you. If you are taking it as marketing, I'd be sure I am recognized as other donors-- as the example I gave with CO USGBC site. I am not a tax specialist. But as Treasurer for my latest nonprofit, I took some IRS courses. Check with your accountant to review your specific situation.

Carol